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Been thinking about the idea of 8 hours span daily map instead of 24/7

Curadh de na Fhiaigh
Solo
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Posted On: 05/08/2014 at 06:55 AM

I don't like the fact that in games like GW2 RvR and ESO AvA the winning factor is who have more players during off peak hours, over-night-map-flipping is boring and unfair.

 

Almost feel like this kind of war map shouldn't be 24/7, but instead operate in 8 hours window, for example something like this:

 

Hopesfire: PST 6:00 PM - PST 2:00 AM daily

Wabbajack: PST 12:00 PM - PST 8:00 PM daily

SkullCrusher: PST 6:00 AM - PST 2:00 PM daily

DawnBreaker: PST 12:00 AM - PST 8:00 AM daily

 

Etc, one can pick three campaigns, no guesting, but lower the campaign switching cost to 1/3 of what it is now.  Map of a certain 8 hours span can be opened depending on demand.  Map score only tick during the 8 hours span it is open daily.

 

This way, you can have maps to cover prime time in different regions for different players.  Concentrate playing hours for a map, reduce "over-night" map flipping which is again very boring and unfair in my opinion.  And you have 3 campaigns to pick from, you can choose to play a higher population one or a lower population one.  The campaign boost you get is from the campaign in which you have the highest score among your 3 campaigns.

 

Comments?

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Caomhnoir de na Capall Donn
Perun
Caomhnoir de na Capall Donn
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Replied On: 05/08/2014 at 02:51 PM PDT
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So the map does not tick for points if that window is not open?  What about players that want to play for end tier reward that live in a time zone outside of that window of a certain campaign/guild? 

What if those players are in a guild that fits mostly into that window?  How will this effect the desire for those players to remain in that guild?  How will this effect the campaign loyalties that are starting to develop?  How is it unfair for a guild like one I am in that is mostly Aussie and plays during off peak hours,  to come in at night and pvp and take keeps?  Big guild teams liken ours that suddenly find it impossible to get everyone in because the entire NA server is concentrated into 2 campaigns?

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Taoiseach de na Arach Glas
Foghladha
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Replied On: 05/08/2014 at 02:58 PM PDT
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This concept was tried in age of connan. Needless to say we don't play age of connan. This would be detrimental to our family as we don't all play at the same time. We have people who play at strange hours. This would exclude them from contributing to our success. The biggest downfall is separating eu and us servers. If they joined them then we would have two sides of the spectrum and less of a flip flip. Everyone has different playtimes. As soon as you start preventing people from doing what they want when they want you run into problems.

I will never endorse a scheduled battle game. For the people who don't play in that schedule it's very discouraging and makes people feel useless 

"It's not the loot and accolades you walk away with, it's the memories and friendships that you cherish forever." - Foghladha
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Laoch de na Ulchabhan Buí
Sekkerhund
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Replied On: 05/08/2014 at 04:43 PM PDT
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Yea, I'm not a fan of the instancing that they've done with AvA.  They've solved nothing that plagues Siege Warfare for multi-server games like Guild Wars, WAR, etc.  

I was under the impression that AvA would be a single integrated megaserver, but its just another instanced PVP design.  I'm very disappointed with that, tbh.  That said, maybe once things die down a bit, they'll go single megaserver with AvA.  #wishfulthinking

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Caomhnoir de na Iomproidh Buí
Tide
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Replied On: 05/08/2014 at 06:17 PM PDT

I think the rotating system will cause a problem especially for bigger families like ours. We have various people online all around 24/7 and by dividing the campaigns into brackets will prevent people from contributing and working towards a single objective/goal.

People will be talking about different campaigns and eventually what will happen is focus will be put on one particular bracket and with folks playing at non-prime hours left out. 

In addition, play time varies, eg. Weekdays primetime = evening, Weekends primetime = might be entire day. Does that mean during weekends all the campaigns will be opened out?

Current AvA campaign span for a very long period of time, so in-order to perform over-night-flipping to really gain an edge will require people to do it consistently over a long period of time. If they are able to do so, in my humble opinion, they deserve it. It is part and parcel of an MMO to have an international audience and have everyone play together. I think it is working as intended.

Just my 2 cents.  



» Edited on: 2014-05-08 18:19:28

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Saighdiuir de na Faolchu
Mickey
Saighdiuir de na Faolchu
Replied On: 05/08/2014 at 06:54 PM PDT

"Overnight map flipping is boring and unfair" to who? Not the players who are active at those times utilising a very basic strategy, hit your enemy at his weakest. Not the players who are not either, they have something to do the next day aside from staring at a map they would otherwise dominate 24/7 with no enemies to fight or objectives to take. And of course there's the points others raised, a 24/7 map lets us all contribute, regardless of work, family or international location. If the map were only active for right hours in US prime time I, and many others, simply would not play with the rest of the family in PvP. 

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Curadh de na Fhiaigh
Solo
Curadh de na Fhiaigh
Replied On: 05/10/2014 at 08:30 AM PDT

I can see the concern that guild like ours cannot concentrate on one campaign and have to pick 2-3 official campaigns.  So maybe this isn't the brightest idea ever :D.  Which is why I throw it out for some discussion.

 

As to why over night flipping is boring and unfair:

 

Boring, why?  You are not fighting any other players, that is PvE not PvP, not to put down PvE, but if you are doing PvE prodominantly in a PvP map, something is wrong.  There is the other 90% of the game that is for PvE, and I do enjoy that part when I am not in the PvP mode.  Which is why at the beginning of Hopesfire campaign our guild guested to other campaign, because when there is no resistance it is boring.

 

Unfair, why?  When you have 100 the other side have 10, it is by definition unfair.

 

Thus I can see maybe dynamic cap on a faction's number is appealing.  Some have been promoting dynamic cap on the official forum.



» Edited on: 2014-05-10 08:30:54

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Ban Finsceal de na Iolair
Morigana
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Replied On: 05/10/2014 at 02:31 PM PDT

I think once things even out they will cull the number of campaigns to even out a little more by pushing players into campaigns that are currently lacking population.  Even GW2 is attempting to still balance WvW.

The Megaserver would be nice if they could possibly increase the number of players on the map otherwise they would instance players into meaningless contests in instances for over flow and then disrupt the flow of the AvA even more - so I really don't see it happening.

Allowing us to guest on more than one campaign as long as we don't have an opposing faction already "guesting" there or have it set as a home for an opposing faction might help some - but this could also cause issues with players just jumping around to whatever one was "winning" at the moment.

I like the commitment to your "home".   Lets just see how it plays out after the first campaign ends and what adjustments the devs make before we get too "suggestive" with changes being needed.  There is always the learning/adjustment curve that happens with the birth of a game.  This game is still an infant - not even in the toddler stage yet.  Not that it is any consolation but it used to take games a year to do a major patch - I know we want it NOW - but lets take a deep breath and give them a chance.  As Fog often states "Coding just doesn't appear" - it does take some time and the very old adage "The best-laid schemes o' mice an' men Gang aft agley" (The best laid plans of mice and men often go awry - for you non Robert burns fans) is even more true for coders. 

I still relish just the aspect of being a part of this world - it is gorgeous - it is fun to explore - and has many great qualities.  I have played 2 classes into their mid 30's and I'm still learning the mechanics - the game provides a challenge that I haven't encountered since my first steps into Norrath as a Barbarian Shaman.  As much as I wish to hit VR10 and give a few of the opposition the same headache they are giving me - I also wish to take my time and see what the devs have planned for the future of both PvE and AvA.  To me it isn't "Rush Hour" - it is more "The Long and Winding Road".

Just my thoughts....

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Ard Tiarna de na Ulchabhan Buí
Elth
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Replied On: 05/10/2014 at 06:52 PM PDT
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Windows of attack don't work. They didn't work in Age of Conan and were in fact exploited by guilds to ensure they were never attacked by their rivals.

If you want to avoid 24/7 warfare, you need to play games with instanced PvP like World of Warcraft or Star Wars.   Morigana is right in that once the campaigns are reduced and the populations are all funneled into the few remaining campaigns these issues should resolve themselves.  The oceanic community only has themselves to blame though, those that organise themselves have always banded together on the one side and then complain about having nobody to fight.  They have done this since as far back as I can remember, and they did it again with ESo by all forming on AD Auriel's Bow Campaign.



» Edited on: 2014-05-10 18:56:26

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Saighdiuir de na Faolchu
Mickey
Saighdiuir de na Faolchu
Replied On: 05/11/2014 at 05:31 AM PDT

10 to 100 is unfair, if the only option the 10 have is head on fights with the 100 everytime. Attacking your enemy while he's weak is a valid tactic. It would be unfair to have no other options. 

 

If you're not the one doing the overnight flipping and being bored by "pve in pvp" then does it really matter if it would be boring to you?

 

Still not seeing why it's an issue. 

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Caomhnoir de na Capall Donn
Perun
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Replied On: 05/11/2014 at 11:07 AM PDT
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So is it unfair when 10 walk through Fogs 100?  This fairness doctrine is baseless.

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Curadh de na Iomproidh
Absolem
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Replied On: 05/11/2014 at 03:14 PM PDT
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The real solution is a Oceanic megaserver.  The primary problem is there's several big AU AvA guilds, and they don't stick to one campaign.  The other problem is that there's way too many campaigns.  Auriel's Bow is banging 24/7.  There's no "offhours" really.  As more people hit VR10, hopefully the campaigns will start feeling a bit less ghosttowny.  Fighting this same exact group of VR10s who traded around emporor over and over (read: exploit) is getting somewhat old now.  Former Emporor stat buffs need to be removed from the game period.  Every one of them takes 10% less damage, less damage from siege, higher regen, everything, and they always have every scroll, in addition to being VR10.


» Edited on: 2014-05-11 15:20:37



» Edited on: 2014-05-11 15:20:54

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Curadh de na Fhiaigh
Solo
Curadh de na Fhiaigh
Replied On: 05/11/2014 at 09:43 PM PDT

@Perun

 

10 walk over Fog's 100 will not work for long since everybody will eventually level up and overpowered skills adjusted.

 

Given similar stats 100vs10 is going to be a slaughter, don't know what is there to argue about.

 

Will see if ZOS come up with something soon.  Because right now everybody in a losing campaign hops to a campaign where their faction is dominating.

 

Even when in due time Gaiscioch folks all level up, we might be the only ones left defending.

 

I guess even when the campaigns end you are still stuck with your campaign unless you switch campaign.  No card reshuffling happen.

 

If ZSO resets everybody's home campaign when campaigns finish, at least the population have a chance to rebalance, it's late but it is better than never.

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Curadh de na Capall Donn
Botak
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Replied On: 05/11/2014 at 09:44 PM PDT

I was testing wabbajack as guest, even though lack or coordination but there's always few battle happening in several location.

 

If zos can combine/merge campaign that would be awesome.

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Caomhnoir de na Capall Donn
Perun
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Replied On: 05/12/2014 at 09:34 PM PDT
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The real solution is a Oceanic megaserver.  The primary problem is there's several big AU AvA guilds, and they don't stick to one campaign.  The other problem is that there's way too many campaigns.  Auriel's Bow is banging 24/7.  There's no "offhours" really.  As more people hit VR10, hopefully the campaigns will start feeling a bit less ghosttowny.  Fighting this same exact group of VR10s who traded around emporor over and over (read: exploit) is getting somewhat old now.  Former Emporor stat buffs need to be removed from the game period.  Every one of them takes 10% less damage, less damage from siege, higher regen, everything, and they always have every scroll, in addition to being VR10.

 

 

Former Emporers do not take less damage from players or siege due to their passives.  They also do not get stat increases or higher regen.  The reduction in damage from players and siege as well as stat increase is coming from the VR10 pact set bonus's,  one of which is detailed at the end.  They farm these pieces out and increase them from green to legendary quality.   

As for the regen increase,  there are at least half a dozen abilities open to all class's that passively increase health, magika and stamina regen.

http://www.esohead.com/skills#line:71

Authority
WHILE EMPEROR
Increases Ultimate gains by 100%, and decreases Ultimate costs by 5%. For former Emperors, decreases Ultimate costs by 5%.
 
Emperor
WHILE EMPEROR
Increases Health, Magicka, and Stamina by 100% while in your campaign.
 
Monarch
WHILE EMPEROR
Increases the magnitude of healing effects on Emperors by 50%, and on former Emperors by 1%
 
Tactician
WHILE EMPEROR
Increases Siege Weapon Damage by 100%. For former Emperors, increases Siege Weapon Damage by 2%.
 
Pact greaves
(3 Items) Adds 155 Max Health
(4 Items) - Reduce damage taken from players by 5%
(5 items) - Reduce damage taken from siege weapons and player AOE spells by 20%
 
 

 

 

I agree wit the campaign merge.  It would adversely hamper large guilds though.  Who knows which way ZOS will go with that one. 

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Curadh de na Capall Donn
Botak
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Replied On: 05/13/2014 at 01:42 AM PDT

Perun,

 

Where do you get that Pact greaves set? Occasionally I saw someone linking the pact bow, pact shield.

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Ban Finsceal de na Iolair
Morigana
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Replied On: 05/13/2014 at 03:39 PM PDT

I really think that when we end up with 100 or so VR10s that we will have the advantage even on non Club Gaiscioch nights.  We are getting more and more leaders taking up the field of battle and eventually it will be 10 of us against 10 of them in the off hours and it will be all tactics at that point.

In RC chat last night we had one of our own talk about how 3 of them took a keep - there were no player defenders.  Tactics are becoming better, players are getting higher level and it will all even out probably by the next campaign or soon after it begins.

Also thanks for that armor set listing Perun - that is a good one for AvA - just need to get high enough now to wear it - and find a crafter to order it from... in that order.  I for one haven't concentrated too much on my armor or weapons (should hit lvl 40 today).  I'm not really in a hurry to hit the VR levels - but it is approaching :)

 



» Edited on: 2014-05-13 15:42:07

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Caomhnoir de na Capall Donn
Perun
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Replied On: 05/13/2014 at 05:14 PM PDT
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Botak  the Pact sets come from bags collected in AvA.  Typically you get them for a certain (I dont know how many) Alliance point gain or keep capture.  They are a rare drop and you can deck your character out in full Pact.  it is quite an OP set for the stats the gear and weapons give.

 

Morigana,  sadly you cannot craft the sets,  you can however upgrade them.  Most serious pvpers are getting 10,  grinding those sets out and upping them to legendary. 

Edit 2 because I fail at thinking.  The set I listed prior is the heavy set.  The light annd medium sets have different stats.  As soon as I can get someone to link them I will post stats here.

 

http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Sets#.U3K28ijj2MQ  This lists all the sets for pvp.  Very informative,  located at bottom of page. 

 


» Edited on: 2014-05-13 17:16:14



» Edited on: 2014-05-13 17:18:15



» Edited on: 2014-05-13 17:23:01

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Laoch de na Ulchabhan Buí
Sekkerhund
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Replied On: 05/14/2014 at 08:36 AM PDT
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It will all balance out in time, its a bell curve issue.  You'll always have the few overachievers that power play a new game 24/7 for the first month or so, just so that they can be the dominating factor for a while.  Its really the easiest way to make your "legend", because everyone learns your name quickly when there's no other competition.  I've seen this same deal in every other MMOPVP game that I've played.  

Six months down the road, they'll barely be remembered and new names, players with actual talent and not level domination, will become known and revered.

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Ban Finsceal de na Iolair
Morigana
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Replied On: 05/15/2014 at 02:47 PM PDT

Sekk  - I agree.

Perun - thanks for the info.  I have quite a ways to go before I start looking for those drops. ;)  but at least I know about them.

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